Secrets to a Drama Free Life | Diana Chapman | 130

When children suppress anger (are told they can't be angry or must go to their room for being angry), they learn that anger itself is bad/unwelcome, which causes them to suppress the emotion chronically rather than allowing it to move through—leading to later behavioral problems

“if your anger could make a sound what's it sound like you know instead of like well if you're going to be angry honey you have to go to your room which only just validates the you know the child's belief that anger's not welcome here and i got to suppress it”

People in knowledge work organizations often become invested in being right because they believe their value/contribution depends on being right, making them unconsciously undermine others and spend effort proving rightness rather than pursuing outcomes

“when i used to work um for a large organization it was a knowledge worker and then you have this vested interest in being right because if i'm not right then what am i doing here what am i contributing and then when you need to be right you spend all of your time and effort not only you know probably unconsciously undermining other people but trying to prove that you're right to other people and you're closed to new data you're closed to different perspectives”

The most impactful factor Chapman has found in making better team decisions is candor—people withhold opinions and stories about each other, and when these remain invisible, teams cannot access the full information and perspectives needed for effective decisions

“people don't practice nearly enough candor i think people are withholding so many opinions and stories about one another and so we're not getting the feedback we need to be able to be more present in the moment in which we can make those decisions”

Persona work involves identifying all the different parts/characters inside us (like a village), understanding their protective function and gifts, and bringing them all to the table.

“i really like this body of work called persona work um some people call it parts work and it's the idea that inside of us is a make is a makeup like inside of us is like a village of all these different characters and they all have different agendas and they all have different strategies for how they move around in the world and that they're brilliant they all showed up somewhere along the way to protect us and they all have superpowers but they also all have shadows”

When people 'soap opera up' the drama triangle (exaggerate it and play with it theatrically), they relax and become more aware because the serious tone that ordinarily accompanies drama shuts down learning, whereas play and humor open learning capacity

“i think having drama triangle physically on the ground to step on and talk about and make big you know i say like let's soap opera this baby up and so let's you know make it the biggest tragedy so it's kind of funny because you know when you're in the drama triangle everything starts to get serious and my experience is the more serious we are the less we learn and if you look at all mammals mammals learn best through play and there's research suggesting that children also are much more able to learn when they're in a states of play”

The cultural push toward political correctness, equally valuing all opinions, and speaking perfectly to avoid offending anyone suppresses the natural learning that comes from mistakes and feedback.

“it seems like we're actually going more in that direction right where the need to be politically correct the need to value everybody's opinion equally even though they're not equally well thought out the need to say things in just the right way so that we don't offend anybody”

We are all like the people who bug us; understanding this creates compassion and prevents the internal wars of self-rejection.

“like if i said something like you know you could be a more effective father and i think maybe you should you know if i i said something something that you believed in too you might hurt yourself with it because there's a little velcro and so some part of you is believing or agreeing with what i'm saying and then you use that to upset yourself so the idea here is i get ultimate decision rights on whether i'm going to upset myself or not and you should you know you might create conditions that make it a little more challenging so if somebody starts yelling at me i might need to take a little more get a little more present to not upset myself and that's where tools like meditation and other skills help people be able to build that awareness so they can stay present in those scenes and it's it's aggravating yeah so then when somebody like the woman who said you have a big head you know to the guy and then you know somebody goes you actually could i you know you don't have a big enough head you know it's like so of course she gets reactive and then she starts to pull away and she gets disconnected from the guy with a big head because he represents something that she has x out in herself and that's what i see going on is we're all projecting on to each other oh i want one like that i'm not like that well yeah we are we are like all we're all like that and it's it's naive to think i'm not like that but that's where all the war comes from that's where the battle is lived is in this belief that i'm separate and not like you instead of i'm just like you in my own way and can i love that part of me so that i can love that part of you”

Diana's whole life is devoted to how good it can be, especially through giving her gifts in ways that serve and meaningfully support others.

“my whole life is in devotion to how good could it be including more most importantly how can i most give my gifts to serve those around me in ways that are really meaningful to me and really supportive to them because that that's one of the things that really is creating one of the most beautiful parts of my life”

Making the invisible visible is what enabled both personal and professional progress throughout this entire conversation.

“and i it feels like a friendlier world it feels like we can do something with that we can't we can't grow with the invisible so that is i think my whole much of my work is about that in my inner work as well as my outer work”

Holding two sides of a polarity equally (believing this is best AND being available to learn it's not) is difficult because it threatens identity, but it's required for wisdom.

“i call it like walking the line of holding two sides of a polarity equally which is i believe this is the best way to go and i'm completely available to learn that it might not be and how do i be in a big enough state of awareness to hold both of those two things equally because most of us can't do that it's difficult because it's it threatens the identity to hold those both equally”

There is a line between two mindsets: 'by me' leadership (life is happening by me, I create my experience) vs. 'to me' leadership (things are happening to me, I'm a victim to circumstances).

“we got this model from gay and katie hendricks and i don't know where they got it from but it's this idea that there is a line and you're either in this above the line mindset or this below the line mindset and when you're above the line you're recognizing life is happening by me and in particular my own experience is happening by me so my emotional states my physical states my mental states are happening by me the circumstances out there are not ultimately the cause of my direct experience here”

The hero is the most challenging role in the drama triangle because culture applauds heroes, creating identity investment in being needed, which requires keeping others disempowered.

“heroin is the most challenging i think in the drama triangle because the culture can really applaud heroes and so our identities go hey look you know people think i'm good for doing these things and uh and so it takes a lot of awareness because in order to hero you need victims and then that means you are requiring people to be disempowered so you can hero and that's not such a you know that's how we're just going to create more battles amongst us”

People try very hard not to feel heartbroken, scared, or upset others around them in order to avoid discomfort, which creates a world that provides forced discomfort to make us uncomfortable.

“i'm watching people trying very hard not to feel heartbroken not to feel scared not to upset others around them so that they don't have to feel any discomfort and so one of the things i'm spending a lot of time with with those i support and uh and hang out with is can we let it be okay to be uncomfortable and uh i think that if we don't choose that consciously we're gonna create a world that provides a lot of discomfort to force us to start to be more uncomfortable”

Millennials are offering a cultural gift by refusing to participate in unconscious cultures; they want cultures where people are 'relaxed, open, curious, and not defending and righteous'—and this is creating pressure for organizational evolution

“i think people are starting to get that and the millennials certainly one of the gifts they're giving us is you know they don't want anything other than that they really want to to be in cultures where people are relaxed and open and curious and um not defending and righteous”

If you're not trying to be righteous, you still use your background, experience, and knowledge to make the best choice you can; you just hold it loosely rather than defensively.

“my answer is well you are going to use your own background your own experience your own knowledge you're going to use those things you're going to use all of your intelligences and you're going to make the best choice that you believe you can make based on what you know and in that way you'll be quote right you'll say i believe i'm right but you'll hold it loosely so that you would be available so somebody could penetrate through and support your curiosity”

To overcome upper limits, the practice is to integrate the goodness through grounding (sweeping floors, watching silly movies, taking baths) that allows the nervous system to recognize and settle into higher well-being.

“in those moments what i've learned is those are the times to integrate to go sweep the floors and just remind yourself wow i could have life this good or uh you know watch a silly movie or take a bath or just just integrate let the nervous system recognize you could be this happy you could be this connected and then once the system is settled in then it's available to even go up a little more”

Activists and advocates with righteous opinions trying to force change perpetuate the problem; authentic change requires dropping righteousness first.

“especially these days because we're getting more and more polarized in our opinions and so it's like you've got to if you're gonna and i work with a lot of activists and i say if you have an opinion that you think you're right about and you're gonna go in and try to from that righteous opinion make any change good luck yeah it's a setup it's a setup you're just part of the issue now”

Most change efforts just 'move the deck chairs around on the titanic'—they appear to change but fundamentally remain the same reactive patterns.

“i guess i think that's the thing i most want to like scream from the rooftops is from my vantage point it's like we're not doing anything new most of the time here we think we are but there's it's just still the same nanette it's just now we switch roles and nobody seems to see that you know can we just wake up to that”

Most people don't know what a whole body yes vs. no feels like because it's not trained; it's a skill that can be developed by practicing on small decisions (menu choices, routes) before applying to big ones.

“i think it's a muscle everybody has but very few of us ever got trained it's like a flaccid muscle but you can build it up over time and i find that most people have a signature inside of themselves for what a yes versus a no feels like and i often walk people through that so they can get a sense of that and then use that and i say start with small stuff like oh i have a menu choice tonight at dinner what what's my body have a whole body yes to uh for for what i'm gonna eat and then practice on little stuff”

Diana's current practice is responding to callings to 'make space'—cutting back like pruning fruit trees removes dead wood so new growth flourishes more fully.

“and so that's a regular practice for me now is whenever i feel it and it's pretty uh clear to me i just had another round of it like make space diana make more space and so it's like um i grow a lot of fruits and vegetables if you knew me and so you know i love cutting it's about ready to cut the fruit trees here cut off all the dead wood um and these trees are gorgeous the way they are they're like why can't we just keep them but it's like cut them back get get rid of the dead wood because you're gonna have something that flourishes even more something stronger you know more blossoms if you cut back”

Gay Hendricks taught Diana about the upper limits problem: people unconsciously limit how good they can feel/have based on family patterns about acceptable levels of happiness.

“gay hendricks is one of my he and katie hendricks my mentors and gay taught me about this concept called the upper limits problem and the idea that a lot of us limit how good we can feel in our bodies how good our relationships could be how good our work can be because we put this limit of how good it could be which often is determined by the families that we came into and the stories that we all hold about you know how much touch laughter fun creativity community can we have abundance”

Diana was not taught much about sex growing up; she discovered that sexual intimacy could be much better than 'good' and started learning everything about couple sexuality.

“i've been with my husband since i was 16. so you have to know that that we were really young when we got together and no one really told us much about sex and i didn't have very much experience but you know everything seemed to be going pretty well but i started to realize like i was getting it starting to come a little ho-hum like it's good i mean it's good every but it's it's just it felt like eating a great hamburger and i realized like what would steak taste like you know what would it be like to have steak more often”

Challenging stories in a co-committed relationship requires demonstrating curiosity and openness rather than righteousness, which invites others to open up.

“so for me it's for myself i like i have this little i call it a sacred law i have these sacred laws inside of myself and they're sacred just because i'm in devotion to presence and so um a sacred law for me is any time i catch myself wanting to be right i immediately pause and just look to see how could the opposite be true or how could the other perspective be at least as true and even when i really want to bite down and like no i'm right which i do a lot i just go uh-uh it's a it's a sacred law here diana you're gonna have to get curious here”

All humans want approval, security, and control; if you can't source these from within yourself, you'll be out in the world trying to control them externally, causing suffering for yourself and others.

“that threat to our approval because gosh we all want to be approved of it's so important and we want to we all want to feel secure you know that i'm going to be part of something and i want to we all want to have that control but that all has to learn to be sourced inside of ourselves because if i can't source all the approval i've ever wanted i'm gonna then be out in the world trying to control my approval and that's going to cause a decent amount of suffering for me and maybe for others too”

The drama triangle is invisible to most people because it operates subconsciously; making it visible (physically stepping on marked triangles, exaggerating patterns) allows people to recognize and change these patterns.

“one of the things that uh strikes me with the drama triangle is that it's all happening at the subconscious level it's all invisible to our sort of conscious mind how do we go about making the invisible visible that's a great question so i'm a huge fan of saying hey look i'm on the drama triangle and let me show you let me show me and so if you knew me when i first learned these things um my husband and i we were practicing together and we got sets of the drama triangle we made cards said the hero villain and victim we laminated them and we put them in our kitchen we put them in our living room and working on our master bedroom and so whenever we'd start to have any kind of a discussion that had any sense of reactivity to it we would literally get on the drama triangle we would step on it”

Most people reject certain parts of themselves and relegate them to an internal dungeon; the work is to open the cellar door, liberate all parts, and learn to play with them.

“and a lot of the work that i have done with myself and with others is to start to name these different parts and to start to play with them and to play with them meaning can i have some fun with them so uh and can i allow them to sit at the table inside of my own beingness because most of us start to say like these parts are okay but these parts aren't and we start to relegate those down just like a dungeon inside of ourselves so a lot of my job has been to go open the cellar door and see who's down there and pull them back up and liberate them”

When we don't allow suppressed parts to be at the table, they play us unconsciously; bringing them online consciously prevents them from playing us reactively.

“so they don't play me so you know everyone you know i would say everybody has a inside of them you know and a lot of us could say like don't be but i say we gotta we gotta let the be at the table because the has a gift and the you know there are moments in life in which we would want the leading the show um she could be really protective here so how do we just though make space except the so that the doesn't run me”

Self-awareness is built by recognizing and honoring all the parts, seeing their value, and learning to play with them consciously.

“and the value of recognizing honoring all the parts all the personas and seeing their great value you know like to your point it's a great value to go get out of the way i gotta i got a person who needs to get to an emergency and i'm willing to cut people off i'm willing to do whatever i have to do to save a life um as long as you know that like we want that part of you and we want him here all the time available whenever he needs to be here so that's a big part of my own work and what i do with a lot of clients and and we find ways to play with it”

Fear is an intelligence that signals you're entering something unknown and should pay attention; rather than suppress it, we should welcome it and let it move through the body.

“i could feel sphere moving through the body right which is an intelligence that says hey you're going into something unknown you don't know what this is like you don't really know shane you don't know how you're gonna dance together pay attention that's the intelligence of my fear”

Many people in the workplace avoid giving candid feedback to colleagues because they cannot be with the physical discomfort that speaking honestly creates, robbing themselves and others of feedback needed for learning and growth.

“so many people are like i'm not i can't even say it because i can't be with myself in the physical experiences that are happening if i speak out loud and i was shocked by multiple people in the circle who just didn't have the willingness to be that uncomfortable and so what they do is they rob themselves and everybody else around them from feedback that could actually help us all learn and grow”

Feedback is always telling us more about the giver than the receiver; understanding this allows us to hold feedback lightly and extract its value rather than defend against it.

“feedback first of all i tell everybody feedback first of all is always telling us about the giver more than the receiver of the feedback”

People should grant each other patience to learn and grow like we grant toddlers—supporting curiosity while also holding clear expectations that everyone must do their work.

“if we're not um we're not giving each other enough space to toddle i really like this word toddle you know like um like i'm a new i'm a little toddler crawling around you know and i want to learn how to walk and that looks so wild to be able to reorient my body like all these adults are and you just see the toddler is trying you know and the adults are saying like great job you know you fell down but and that you don't see the toddler saying bad toddler you know what's wrong with me you see this toddler staying so curious”

Truth is not 'my truth vs. your truth'—it's whether something works; knowing what works for a certain population is a valid basis for sharing and recommending it.

“the ultimate question is not whether this is my truth versus your truth or how i see the situation versus how you see the situation it's more like does it work right right i have a bunch of stuff that works for me and when i share it with a certain group of people it really works for them and so that's all i know is i know it works for some population of the planet and so perhaps it might work for you maybe not take what works and ignore the rest”

Egos and identities need to feel right to secure themselves; letting go of being right exposes vulnerability and fear, which is why people defend their righteous perspectives.

“ego and identities need to feel right in order to secure themselves and if i were to let go of being right from that righteous point of view which is like a right that defends itself what's underneath that is a lot more vulnerability a lot more of i don't know a lot more fear and if you're not comfortable with that then the identity is going to secure itself all back up again”

You are not responsible for others' hurt feelings, but you are responsible for the conditions you create; others have ultimate decision rights over whether they hurt themselves with your words.

“the idea here is i get ultimate decision rights on whether i'm going to upset myself or not and you should you know you might create conditions that make it a little more challenging so if somebody starts yelling at me i might need to take a little more get a little more present to not upset myself and that's where tools like meditation and other skills help people be able to build that awareness so they can stay present in those scenes”

Drama is defined by repeating patterns of reactivity rather than reasoning; reactivity prevents the pausing and awareness needed to understand what's happening.

“why is it called the drama triangle i think my sense is because in in that in those three roles what you get is drama you know you get recycling patterns where people are reactive and so that's that's a definition for drama is you know repeating patterns of reactivity i i think that word reactive is is really important because when we react what we're not doing often is reasoning”

When someone suppresses a feeling by trying not to express it, the suppressed emotion creates a cognitive-emotional loop where the mind creates stories that reactivate the feeling, perpetuating suffering.

“if it doesn't pass then it does it does drop it does become suppressed and then what can happen is a story can start to be created and then that story the the mind starts to want to be right about the story and it can create what we call a cognitive emotive loop in which then it now is not just an emotion that's moving through the body it's now a story i hold but then i activate with a feeling that then activates the story and it loops and it can go on and on and on”

When people with different leading intelligences (IQ, EQ, BQ) disagree, they should honor each other's intelligence: one person might contribute data/logic, another emotion/intuition, another body sensing/instinct.

“so what we have to do is honor that that's one of the reasons why we like the diversity amongst us is maybe you have some data that will suggest why my idea is or is not a good idea um or maybe you have some emotional intelligence that says you know as i'm hearing you speak i notice i feel really scared and uh the fear is very strong in me and i'm not sure that we know enough yet to make that decision”

Bezos's observation that when body disagrees with data, the body is usually right and the data is wrong demonstrates the importance of body intelligence in decision-making.

“when my body disagrees with the data it's usually my body that's right and the data that's wrong”

Diana's son wanted to grow marijuana; her head said no based on worries about parental judgment, but her body said 'let them grow,' and this turned into a successful business and catalyzed his education and social development.

“when he turned 18 he'd already graduated from high school he said i want to grow marijuana i can do it legally and i want to grow my head the data in my head said heck no no way what would every other parent on the planet think if i let my kid is already probably using too much start growing large amounts of marijuana but my body my body was so clear it just said let them grow and it was just kind of like inside of my own self it was like what like are you kidding uh but i said okay if you can prove that you can make it legal”

Learning (being in 'by me' leadership) is the most important thing; it's a state of awe—'let's find out what the world is like' rather than defending preconceptions.

“and learning when you're in a by me leadership stance learning is the most important thing and it's like it's being in a state of awe like well let's it's a wild world out there let's find out what's it going to be like you know that that whole state of being righteous i never heard it in that term before”

Diana works hard to help teams practice telling each other the stories they make up about one another; there's almost always a gem (useful truth) in every story.

“so um you know i'm i'm working hard to open teens up to like can we just tell each other our stories that we make up in our heads about each other because it's about you and it's good to know what stories people make up about us because my experiences there's almost always a gem in every story that somebody has about me”

Rather than asking 'Is the story about me true?' ask 'How is it true?' to find the gem and learn something valuable about yourself.

“and from presence i always ask the question not is it true what you're what you're saying about me but how is it true how is it true that i'm you know not as effective as i could be or how is it true that i'm not listening enough or how is it true”

We tend to judge people as persons based on single wrong ideas rather than evaluating issues on a case-by-case basis, which prevents learning and growth.

“we don't what struck me about what you said is the tolerance for other people like we it's like we forget that other people are human and they do make mistakes and they can be wrong and instead of looking that at an issue basis we look at it as a person basis well diana diana said something you know that was incredibly silly therefore diana we're not going to value her opinion anymore”

The woman's feedback that a colleague has 'a big head' reveals her own relationship with confidence and self-assertion, not an objective fact about the colleague.

“some woman on that same team she said to one of her colleagues i have this thought that you have a big head and that it keeps you from being more effective well what she told me first of all is likely that she doesn't either acknowledge her own big head and or she doesn't make that valuable about her uh which turned out somebody else in the room said i actually would trust you more if you had more of a big head”

'Whole body yes' is a practice of considering options with full mind-body-emotion integration; only actions that get a 'yes' from all three centers should be pursued.

“whole body yes is this idea that when i'm given options of how i want to move forward in the world i consider the option with my full body and this comes back to iq eq bq so i'm listening to this intelligence that's moving through me that says yes or no”

Workplaces are messy by nature, and trying to suppress messiness is a rip-off to everyone because the neater we try to be, the less growth we experience.

“it's workplaces are inherently messy and one of the things that came up in my research is you value that messiness in the workplace... what i see is is the the neater we try to get the less growth we actually get to experience”

After exaggerating a drama pattern, the next step is recognizing you're dramatizing because you're scared, then willing to move from threat to trust mode.

“what's next is all what's next is can you just recognize you're in this dramatizing goal you guys because you're scared there's you're a threat feels like a threat to your security or control or approval people most people will go yeah i am threatened i do feel threatened now a few people will say i don't think i'm threatened but then if you help them see a little more clearly everybody eventually gets to see okay you're right i'm in a state of threat so the first thing i know is if you can't accept the fact that you're in a state of threat you'll never shift anything”

When people move from threat to trust through willingness, their three intelligence centers (IQ, EQ, BQ) turn on, making them available for learning and creative problem-solving.

“and then if people are willing then now they're in a more open state they're open in their minds they're open in their emotional states they're open in their bodies and i say then their three centers are turned on iq eq bq which is a metaphor i like to use and then from that place from that state of presence they're a lot more available for learning and a lot more available for a new solution”

Teams that are most present will win in the future because the world is becoming more chaotic and unpredictable; presence is the competitive advantage.

“i mean and i think this is going to be i think we're going to see this more and more you know for a long time you could have a really unconscious culture and a lot of drama and be wildly successful as a business i don't think that's going to be the future i think the teams that are the most present are going to win the games and i think we're just we're moving into a much more chaotic uh cult you know world and things are not gonna be as predictable and we're gonna need all of our wits about us and presence will be the gift that gets us”

Most people were trained in school to value IQ highly and weren't trained in emotional intelligence or body intelligence; leaders who can access all three centers equally are more effective.

“we didn't get trained most of us in schools to honor body intelligence you know we have most of us didn't get trained for emotional intelligence either we mostly have been valuing iq so much which is great iq is fantastic but i find that leaders who are able to access all three centers equally knowing they have a lead in one are more able to make effective decisions”

Creating hot, juicy sex requires tools and understanding of what conditions enable it; if people had better understanding, many more would be motivated to cultivate great sex lives.

“so i'm asking people to learn and understand more about how could it be so delicious and intimate and enlivening that um you know you couldn't help but want to make sure you create time in your life to create curate those experiences and it's not for everybody i want to honor everybody has their own different preferences and needs but i think there's a lot more people who would be interested in cultivating a really hot juicy sex life if they had more tools and understanding of what does steak look like”

When a startup team faces loss (missed revenue goals, failed fundraising), allowing them to grieve their lost expectations allows them to be present to current reality and address it effectively.

“a lot of them are grieving that they had ideas that they would have a certain number of users by you know xyz or they'd have so much money in the bank or they'd have investors coming in and they have to let go and they have to feel the wisdom of you got to let go so you can actually be with what's here now and deal with that because if you can't if you can't let go of that beautiful picture you had you you can't really see the beautiful picture that's now here but just in a different way”

Diana received a direct calling 20 years ago to move to California despite having a perfect life in the Midwest; this catalyzed a process of repeatedly listening to callings for more exquisite possibilities.

“and there was this day where it was kind of the first and last day i ever heard such a very direct call but it just said you got to move to california and i was like uh it's so good here though i just built my dream house with my husband i mean it was so good but there was just this sense of there's something calling you that's gonna be even more exquisite than this and so i didn't have a job my husband did my job we just said like we're gonna take the lead to california we didn't know where we're gonna live it was just this really radical surrender”

Performance standards are raised not through force but through developing presence and using tools (meditation, phone reminders, gym in consciousness) to cultivate awareness.

“the more i can be in the present moment rather than in an imagined future that i'm scaring myself with and trying to respond to or you know caught up in a bunch of wounds from my past the more i can be right here right now in a non-triggered non-reactive state the more effective i'm going to be and so it's all about cultivating a set of tools that i like and everybody has their own set of tools that they like but what are the tools that we're going to use that bring us back to presence over and over and over again”

Browbeating people with the newspaper (forcing them to change through pressure) creates hidden resentment that emerges later as negatively coiled spring.

“even when we were able you know i think that the days of us like brow beating people over the head with the newspaper to get them to do stuff is sort of like long gone but even when that worked it didn't really work like it worked in the moment but what you really did was you you made invisible right this resentment that i have that becomes like this negatively coiled spring that is going to come out one day in it you know it might be three months from now it might be six months from now but it will come out because the story that i've told myself about that is one where i'm the victim and i need to extract some sort of vengeance if you will”

When you notice yourself saying 'I can't believe this is happening' or 'Wow, I feel so close to you,' you're at your upper limit edge; this is the moment to integrate the goodness rather than create conflict to reduce it.

“you'll know it you'll you'll say things like um gosh you know i can't even remember a day as good as this or can you believe this is happening or wow honey i feel so close to you all of those things are all indicators that i'm right on the edge of how good i can handle things and so for example we see these patterns show up in couple hoods you know because of upper limits which i think makes a lot of sense more couples will fight on friday night than any night of the week”

Diana worked with a woman whose unconscious pattern created bad sex: she believed her partner would leave if she expressed preference, never voiced desires, and prioritized his needs—and this pattern was completely self-generated.

“so i was working with a group of women i think it was like a ypo uh spouses uh forum and one of the women was complaining about having bad sex and so i said i want you to teach us the course i want you to imagine that we're all here and we have come to learn how to have bad sex and we want to have bad sex just like you have so could you put together a list of everything that we would need to do or be in order to have bad sex so she thought about it for a little bit she said well first of all believe that if you tell him that you don't like something that he'll go away and won't won't take care of you so you got to believe that right off the beginning secondly um keep all of your preferences to yourself and just hope that he'll figure it out uh third um do whatever he wants and don't really ask at all don't believe believe that his needs are going to be more important than yours”

A more direct way to challenge stories is to have people argue the opposite position as if their life depends on it, or physically move to the opposite side and argue from there.

“another more direct way would be i hear that could you argue like let's say your life depends on it could you argue the other side for a minute um and see how what we can learn over on that side of things i really like to play like imagine there's a jury and you have to argue the other side um sometimes with teams they'll be well it's pretty it's pretty common that when there's a big choice to be made teams often divide almost right down the middle which is i think a law of nature the polarity forms and half the team says this way and half 18 says this and so one of my favorite exercises is put a piece of tape down in the middle of the room and i say first argue for your side first the side that you really and really go at it let's debate and then i have the move and physically move their bodies to the other side and i say now you have to argue from the side that you're on”

At Chapman's retreats, participants are asked to exaggerate and perform their disowned parts publicly (dressed as characters, playing out 'insensitive' at dinner) so they can experience the part consciously, find its value, and bring it into their full response range

“we actually take everybody in the retreat out to dinner publicly and we have you all dressed up as characters and so i would say i would say shane all night long you just have to be super insensitive so in the waiters and you're gonna like tell the waiter like get over here i have an order you're like you're going to play out your rude insensitive one to it and exact exaggerate it and just see what it's like to be that way and give yourself some freedom”

Diana leads with body intelligence (BQ) rather than intellectual or emotional; she experiences knowing directly through sensation and gut feel without intellectual data.

“i lead with bq that's my i feel things i don't have to i don't intellectually know a lot a lot of the things that i that i um can go toward i feel them it's like a mammal maybe who goes back to a watering hole hundreds of miles away i just kind of know my way and that's challenging when you say to a group of people like i think we should go this way and people say well where's your data”

Anything other than a whole body yes is a no; this practice raises the bar for commitments and prevents settling for 'good' instead of 'exquisite.'

“and so i say anything other than a whole body yes is a no and i think it's a great skill to have and it takes a little time i think it's a muscle everybody has but very few of us ever got trained”

Most people can only play a limited set of their internal keys and are thus unavailable to respond to many situations that need different parts.

“but most people i see have decided like these things are good and this is me i'm this and i'm not that and then when the moment comes i can't actually respond to it because i don't have access to my full self”

The initial response we have to something is often highlighting parts we've suppressed; our conscious mind then creates a different story to manage that suppressed response.

“it's funny that you know when you're talking about that i'm thinking you know my initial response is like one thing and then my conscious mind takes over and i create a different story around it and i think that initial response to your point is highlighting parts of us that maybe we suppress and don't let out yeah and that's why it's aggravating”

All parts/emotions are like keys on a keyboard; the responsive person has access to all keys equally, not just the 'nice' ones, and chooses what the moment asks for.

“i like to think about like these parts are like keys on a keyboard you know we have ting ting ting and we have boom boom boom we have everything in between and when you're really present you're going to ask all those keys are equal the ones that the sweet and the ones are they're all equal and so i'm just looking to see what's the scene asking for and sometimes the scene might ask for your insensitive you know rude guy because he actually may be just the right voice to address the moment that could help shift everything in a different way”

Intensity is not the same as aliveness; people often confuse intensity (drive, passion, adrenaline) with aliveness, creating addiction to intensity that leads to burnout.

“i don't think intensity i don't think anyone can be consistently intense uh and uh i think that that's a great setup for burnout which is what i see all over the place um and so when you say intensity it's a state it's got a lot of at least for me in there it's it's drive it's passion it's alive it's um and it's like to me it's like a weather pattern you know there are times when it's great it's a great weather pattern to have and it meets the moment and then there are times when it needs to be this like quiet still like”

Procrastination might create artificial intensity through tight deadlines to generate the dopamine/adrenaline rush needed to push through uncomfortable work.

“one of the things that uh strikes me with the drama triangle is that it's all happening at the subconscious level it's all invisible to our sort of conscious mind how do we go about making the invisible visible that's a great question so i'm a huge fan of saying hey look i'm on the drama triangle and let me show you let me show me and so if you knew me when i first learned these things um my husband and i we were practicing together and we got sets of the drama triangle we made cards said the hero villain and victim we laminated them and we put them in our kitchen we put them in our living room and working on our master bedroom and so whenever we'd start to have any kind of a discussion that had any sense of reactivity to it we would literally get on the drama triangle we would step on it and we would move our our physical bodies around on the bases as we could feel ourselves you know like you know i can't believe you didn't get the kids to school on time you know i'm now i'm on villain you know and then i always have to do it and i can never count on you and and so i would just run around on those bases so i could see oh as long as i'm going to have the conversation from here i'm not really going to be able to learn and grow and really understand how am i co-creating these scenes that i tell myself in the world i don't want but yet unconsciously i'm creating them and so if i'm on the drama triangle those will never those will never become aware so i'll never be able to permanently shift those issues so i think having drama triangle physically on the ground to step on and talk about and make big you know i say like let's soap opera this baby up and so let's you know make it the biggest tragedy so it's kind of funny because you know when you're in the drama triangle everything starts to get serious and my experience is the more serious we are the less we learn and if you look at all mammals mammals learn best through play and there's research suggesting that children also are much more able to learn when they're in a states of play so if i'm serious about something and it's not funny and the more not funny it is the more likely i am to shut down my the all the awareness and all the learning that could actually really take me to a new place so i like when i go into a team i'll say all right what's one of the issues that you guys have going on and they might say um you know we haven't made numbers the last two quarters and i say okay let's make this the best drama you've ever seen like everybody you know imagine we've all been at the bar we've had several drinks we're a little sloppy get on the drama triangle and really moan about this issue and first of all that's sort of relieving to a lot of people because it's like really i get to do that and so i let them get on the bases and moan and complain and who's to blame and who how do you fix it and how are you at the effect of it and just letting that out we all get to go ah okay all those parts get to one and complain now what now are we willing to get off this drama triangle so that we can actually really learn how to co-create a different option and so i'm all for exaggeration and play around when we're when we're in the triangle walk me through what's next like you do that you have that session you moan you complain you get it out you over exaggerate you feel really good and then you feel open and a little bit safe i would imagine what's next what's next is all what's next is can you just recognize you're in this dramatizing goal you guys because you're scared there's you're a threat feels like a threat to your security or control or approval people most people will go yeah i am threatened i do feel threatened now a few people will say i don't think i'm threatened but then if you help them see a little more clearly everybody eventually gets to see okay you're right i'm in a state of threat so the first thing i know is if you can't accept the fact that you're in a state of threat you'll never shift anything and so i really i play i pay a lot of attention like looking at who's the one who's scared you know i could feel it today like the one who felt a little threatened about coming on today you know like how old is she and i look at i'm like she's she's from third grade i don't like what is that nine or ten she's nine or ten and um and she got kind of bullied on the playground when she went to a new school and the kids didn't know her and so that part of me is here worried that this might happen again and so i just go oh sweetheart you're just scared yeah come sit on my lap so if you know me i do that to myself like oh you're just come on have a seat and i'm not trying to stop it or numb it i'm well like you are welcome to be scared let's move that all the way through to completion take a breath with that welcome all those sensations and then check and see is there something that you need and can we get that source from within so that then you can be able to respond so first and foremost after you recognize you're in this reactive place in the drama triangle except you're scared and then after that you just check and see would i be willing to move from threat to trust so i ask questions of myself and others like would i be willing to stop blaming anybody if we all stopped blaming and we all recognize we each have a part to play so i could start to look at how am i co-creating this rather than throwing blame over someplace else and would i be willing to stop being righteous about this so that there can be something i can learn because right now obviously there's something i don't know if i did i'd solve this already and would i be willing to feel my feelings about this and when i'm willing to other people feel theirs and what i'd be willing to really listen to the other side most of us don't listen and would i be willing to be honest like really truly candid if i've had to thought three or more times would i say it out loud instead of withholding it would i be willing to recognize likely there's been some broken agreements here that have caused some of this and how am i how have i been a part of that so i ask people these questions we call them willingness questions to see would you be willing to shift out of threat to trust and then if people are willing then now they're in a more open state they're open in their minds they're open in their emotional states they're open in their bodies and i say then their three centers are turned on iq eq bq which is a metaphor i like to use and then from that place from that state of presence they're a lot more available for learning and a lot more available for a new solution i want to explore the iq eq bq in just one second but before we get to that this triangle has three points on it um sort of victim hero and villain talk to me are they all equally weighted like is one a better position to be in the other or are they all the same they're all the same they all are taking either more or less than 100 responsibility in their own ways so they're all not really taking full ownership and they all have they're all really brilliant honestly i mean i really appreciate our psyches that created these structures to protect ourselves because that's what the drama triangle is it's a reactive defense mechanism that we've all set up and they each of those bases is equally valuable in its defense mechanism so um and my experience is that when people are dealing with any issue they're going to be on all three bases they're going to have some of each now some of us tend to we learn to do relationship being more of a hero or more of a villain or more of a victim or some combination and that often comes because maybe those bases were already taken by the people we grew up with and so that's kind of a natural default that we go to so we have typical patterns that we do but they're all equally weighted”

The 'fact and story' practice: separate observable facts from the stories/interpretations you make about them, helping teams become more aware of their interpretations.

“i like this practice i i use with teams a lot called fact and story so i'll say let's say shane you and i are on a team and i say um shane the facts are that you led a podcast between the two of us earlier today and then i would say here's a story i make up about that in my hopefully i'm holding the story with curiosity um and so i you know i'll say i'm you know i make up a story that and then i tell the story but i can as a team member if i can put a fact in story it kind of helps the person relax a little bit to go i it's just a story and it gives them a little freedom to speak more candidly to one another”

Couples disproportionately fight on Friday nights (most fights of the week) and Sunday nights (second most) because these create threats to their upper limits—Friday opens the weekend with potential closeness, Sunday means the shared time is ending—triggering unconscious limit-enforcement through conflict

“more couples will fight on friday night than any night of the week and i think that's an upper limits pattern because it's like oh honey we have the whole weekend now to you know have more connection and so that'll be a threat somehow to well you know to how good we can have it so we'll fight and then maybe we spend the weekend unwinding our fight the second most popular night of the week to fight is on sunday nights and that i think is also an upper limb it's like oh we've had so much connection i feel really bonded so let's have a fight to bring ourselves to a more familiar place”

The practice of noticing sensations in the body without trying to fix them, then welcoming them like you'd welcome a friend, allows them to move through and complete, freeing you to be available for the moment.

“so first of all i just go what's happening what are these bits doing oh there's a swirling there's a little bit of a clenching there's a narrowing so i'm paying attention to that and then the second thing i say is can i just welcome all of that can i let that be here as much as it is and not make that a problem and you know whatever it is just welcome it like you'd welcome your best friend into your house like hey man come on in so just welcome it and then just the welcoming of it helps it move all the way through so it can go wherever it needs to go and then i can be available for the moment”

The parts we dislike about ourselves often appear as the people who bug us most; this indicates we haven't liberated that part in ourselves.

“what kind of people bug you the most out in the world yeah people who aren't aware uh who just aren't conscious of other people like who don't hold the door or just have no context of like that they're impacting other people okay good so then what you and i feel horrible even saying that out loud so right so then what you tell me is you don't live you haven't allowed that part of you to be at the table”

People are told not to have a big head, be too happy, or be too sure of themselves as forms of teaching humility, but this suppresses aliveness and joy.

“who do you think you are you know you think you're so you think you're so much you know a lot of us got told that like don't have a big head don't be too happy don't be too sure of yourself don't be too full of yourself and of course there's the i get the message underneath there about be humble and but it but it's like could we be humble and be like just having a blast”

'Willingness questions' are: (1) Would I be willing to stop blaming? (2) Would I be willing to stop being righteous about this? (3) Would I be willing to feel my feelings? (4) Would I be willing to really listen to the other side? (5) Would I be willing to be truly candid? (6) Would I be willing to recognize broken agreements I've had a part in?

“would i be willing to stop blaming anybody if we all stopped blaming and we all recognize we each have a part to play so i could start to look at how am i co-creating this rather than throwing blame over someplace else and would i be willing to stop being righteous about this so that there can be something i can learn because right now obviously there's something i don't know if i did i'd solve this already and would i be willing to feel my feelings about this and when i'm willing to other people feel theirs and what i'd be willing to really listen to the other side most of us don't listen and would i be willing to be honest like really truly candid if i've had to thought three or more times would i say it out loud instead of withholding it would i be willing to recognize likely there's been some broken agreements here that have caused some of this and how am i how have i been a part of that”

When you care about outcome over ego (as an investor does), you naturally don't care whose idea it is—you just want the best result, which shifts motivation away from proving yourself right.

“and that you know shifts when you when you have more skin in the game you tend to think that way naturally right like it doesn't matter whose idea it is as long as we're all getting better”

Many people have unhappy sex lives because they don't know how good it could be or don't have tools to create conditions for good sex; they're grieving this loss.

“i'm really uh blown away by how many people are not having happy sex lives and who got stuck and because it just it was boring or they were too busy or because they didn't know how good it could be you know there was nothing that captivated them to stay engaged in that and so it just fell to the wayside and you know a lot of people really grieving that and wishing it were different”

Fear of being proven wrong or looking like an idiot in the future prevents people from sharing ideas, resulting in a worse world.

“one thing that came to mind is sort of like we're you know in a way more fearful of putting ideas out there because they could be proven wrong in the future or we could look like an idiot in the future and so we just don't put those ideas out there and then we end up you know the world ends up in a worse place because of that”

Diana has been hiding her experiential knowledge because she fears it will be invalidated or dismissed if it lacks scientific data, and she's learning to speak it anyway and let others learn from her feedback.

“and i can feel that part of me that gets scared of am i going to come on and people are going to dis miss what i have to say because it doesn't have scientific data to back it up or whatever and you know for a long time i think myself and others we hide out because don't come speak out about just your own experience or what you know because if it's invalidated you know it feels um dismissive and people feelings can get hurt”

The drama triangle has three roles: victim (disempowered, whining), villain (blaming self or others), and hero (seeking temporary relief). People learn these roles from their families and use them unconsciously.

“the theory is that we all have learned to do relationship most in this role of victimhood and that there are three unique flavors of victimhood and so um the first one is the pure victim and you know shane it's so hard and the hours and my emails and oh my gosh and the kids and kobit and now now the masks and oh my gosh you know there's just all this i'm at the effect of and uh and so victim has this sense of disempowerment”

Parents are unconsciously fearful of being judged by other parents when their children have public difficulties, adding a second layer of fear beyond concern for the child.

“and one of the things you mentioned in that i find myself dealing with all the time which is how what will other parents think of me and you know when i'm conscious about it i'm like i really don't care uh but there's this this unconsciousness to it where oh my god like if my kid has a temper tantrum like what are other parents can i'm a bad parent all of a sudden right”

Chapman's experience is that most people know much more than they allow themselves to be aware of; whole body yes is a practice to reclaim and trust the knowing that's already present but suppressed by doubt and overthinking

“my experience is people do know a lot more than they are willing to let themselves be aware of”

Diana is glad to see public conversations about sexuality (e.g., Gwyneth Paltrow's show) emerging; teachers who previously hid are coming out publicly to enable conversations.

“i'm looking forward to more and more conversations coming out more publicly about this i i was just starting to watch um when if paltrow has this new show called i think it's like love sex or something like that i thought oh hallelujah some of these teachers who've been you know hiding back in the corners that you can't really access are now coming out more publicly and we get to talk about these things”

Diana is actively working on her own upper limits, expanding the ceiling for how good life can be, experiencing constant humming/ecstatic aliveness.

“and i've really been playing around with addressing my own upper limit in myself that keeps me from having it even more exquisite than i had known before... it's like i feel like i'm humming inside all the time like it's this delicious it's ecstatic feeling of aliveness and joy um and all the other feelings that come through that are enlivening”

In 'to me' leadership, people blame external actors for their feelings ('you hurt my feelings'), abdicating responsibility for their own experience.

“when i'm in leadership from to me it's more of those things out there are affecting me it's happening to me so i don't get to have ultimate creatorship here i'm now a victim to some of the circumstances around me and so therefore i could you know from that mindset i might say shane you hurt my feelings you know you are the cause of my hurt feelings”

Chapman's own life exemplifies integrated aliveness: excellent marriage ('one of the best I don't see anything better'), thriving relationships with children, deep friendships (many integrated into her business), beautiful physical environment, outdoor living, service/meaningful work, all built through devotion to aliveness and integrating discomfort

“if you knew me you would know i have a fantastic marriage i think it's one of the best i don't i don't see anything better i've seen maybe some equal ones but i have a great marriage i've worked a lot of time on that marriage i have fantastic relationships with my children i have an amazing community of friends i mean i love them i mean i actually created a business in which i brought a lot of my friends in so like most the time when i hang on business call it's i love you like it's crazy i live in a beautiful place i get to be outside hiking all the time it's so good”

Once someone realizes the specific choices/beliefs they've enacted to create a problem (e.g., mediocre sex), the solution is simply to do the opposite—no therapist or coach needed, only the willingness to make uncomfortable choices

“you don't need a therapist here unless you need some healing about this but you don't need a coach you don't need anybody you've just written down exactly the steps for how you've created a mediocre sex life just go do the opposite of every one of those things and your sex life is going to radically improve”

Chapman identifies that one key unlock to 'getting out of our own way' (and thus solving major societal and interpersonal problems) is deep interpersonal work around loving the parts of ourselves and others that feel most threatening or unacceptable

“i think that's going to be one of the number one keys to all of us getting out of our own way here is this deep interpersonal work around loving these parts”

The hero role seeks temporary relief from problems rather than addressing root causes, creating recurring patterns (e.g., netflix after work, listening to gossip, throwing money at charity without accountability).

“and then finally is the role of the hero and the hero's job is to seek temporary relief and that really is the key word is temporary so i'm at the end of the day i'm so burned out where's the netflix where's my pinot noir where's even going for a run or something that gives me a little relief and it works day after day it works but i never go address the core issue of like wait a minute what's going on that i'm living my life such that i come home at the end of the day so burned out”

Chapman led a team through multiple rounds of the fact and story exercise and found it consistently revealed insights that had never been surfaced, elephants that came out of the room, and resulted in the team reporting it was 'one of the best practices they've done in a long time'

“reliably i get feedback that that may have been one of the best practices they've done in a long time that they learned things that had not been learned elephants came out um people people got valuable feedback and they realized like we don't give any time and attention to being able to reveal these stories in a way that lets us all evolve”